Comment by graeme

Comment by graeme 3 months ago

89 replies

Tiktok is actually surprisingly national in how it serves its content. If you're outside the US you don't see most American accounts except the ones that go very viral.

Edit: I should clarify. This might mean most content you see is English, if you're interested in English content. However it matters where the video was geographically uploaded from. If you upload a tiktok video and check the stats you'll see most views are from your region or country.

Tiktok shows videos locally, then regionally and then finally worldwide if yoo have a big hit.

It would be interesting to know what fraction of the English content people see is posted geographically from within America.

MasterScrat 3 months ago

This hasn't been my experience, using TikTok from Switzerland, I almost exclusively see English language, with a focus on my interests

  • pepinator 3 months ago

    Switzerland has just 8 million people, which are divided into two big language groups. And most people speak (or at least understand) English. So, it's natural for the algorithm to converge to content in English.

    • epolanski 3 months ago

      Lived in Switzerland and this is really not true.

      What I've learned is that since Switzerland has 3 official languages (German, French and Italian) children and teens at school focus on learning one of the other two regions they are not from.

      In particular this leads to French and Italian cantons to be moderately fluent in each other's language. Strikingly when I lived in Lausanne, more people knew Italian than English. English was really not on their radar (plus, add that francophones are kind of elitist when it comes to languages and don't really like to consume content that is not in french).

      In German speaking Switzerland proficiency in English was still subpar from most of the rest of Europe when walking in a shop or going to a restaurant.

      • secstate 3 months ago

        Not to derail, but when I was in Switzerland, I found the German Swiss to be far more elitarian about NOT learning French, than the other way around. And French Swiss being a minority, they kinda got treated as other or less-than in the bulk of Switzerland. But all German Swiss are at least willing to try English, while the French Swiss tend to avoid English, so maybe that's where the vibe comes from?

      • smitty1110 3 months ago

        > What I've learned is that since Switzerland has 3 official languages

        Everyone always forgets Romansh...

      • sschueller 3 months ago

        Switzerland has 4 official languages and English is not one of them.

        • pjmlp 3 months ago

          As someone that lived there, and still returns regularly, it is kind of funny to have more fluency in three of those languages, kind of superficially understand the fourth, while many Swiss nationals have to switch to a non official language to understand among themselves when coming from different language regions.

          Italian cantons usually focus on German and English, German rather learn English or Italian, French put up with English, and most stop learning the other official languages after the school year where they are compulsory.

          Naturally a bit of stereotype, and each as a different experience.

      • [removed] 3 months ago
        [deleted]
    • Pooge 3 months ago

      > And most people speak (or at least understand) English.

      This is wrong. In cities where there's a lot of tourism, they might understand. Most Swiss people only speak their local languages (German or French). As for those living in Ticino, they tend to be better polyglots.

      • Lukas_Skywalker 3 months ago

        That doesn‘t match my experience.

        About 40% of all Swiss inhabitants speak English at least once a week [1].

        Anecdotally, I can't think of a single acquaintance younger than 50 years old that doesn't speak fluently. Everyone in Switzerland learns English at school for at least five years. Most even for seven years.

        Some of my German speaking friends even talk in English to French speaking people, even when both have learned the other‘s respective language at school.

        [1]: https://www.bfs.admin.ch/bfs/de/home/statistiken/bevoelkerun...

      • pjmlp 3 months ago

        English is quite common to speak among Swiss from different cantons, since they usually stop caring about the other official languages after the compulsory school classes.

        I find kind of ironic that I have better fluency between the official languages than many of my Swiss friends and work colleagues.

      • seanmcdirmid 3 months ago

        I met plenty of people in Lausanne who didn't speak English, or at least didn't want to speak English (it is hard to tell, and anyways, it doesn't really matter). I visited Montreal shortly after my 2 year stay in Lausanne ended and I was surprised on how multi-lingual people were there.

      • paulg2222 3 months ago

        It is not German, but Alemannic.

    • elliotec 3 months ago

      This is simply not true. Even standard German is a second language in Switzerland. I’m Swiss.

  • crucialfelix 3 months ago

    It depends what you interact with. I tried it fresh today and it quickly decided I'm a Berliner muslim who likes Nigerian food because I lingered for a minute on something. That interest graph is very fast and volatile.

  • sushid 3 months ago

    Uhh... that's kind of how these algorithms work. I presume you interact (i.e. don't scroll past) with a lot of the English posts. It's going to index on that and show you more English content. When I'm abroad, I might see a few posts in their native language but the algorithm will revert to showing English posts about the city/country once it realizes I'm not really jiving with Portuguese posts, for example.

    • econ 3 months ago

      An illiterate coworker of mine showed me his phone and asked for help. It was utterly amazing, he exclusively got videos from goat and donkey farmers. The most stunning part was that most of the videos were completely hilarious. People talking to their goat then the goat does what they say or the opposite on purpose.

  • [removed] 3 months ago
    [deleted]
  • financypants 3 months ago

    i mean, we all have the algorithm tailored to what we want to see, so the parent comment here is kind of a moot point, right?

    • datavirtue 3 months ago

      I joined TikTok and was immediately barraged with naked young girls. Haven't been back since.

Kkoala 3 months ago

My experience is that it serves you the content that you spent time watching and engaging with.

And it's quite easy to steer it towards a certain topic if you want to

spandrew 3 months ago

I believe the algo is somewhat timezone based, too.

Very common for ppl to be served Chinese or asian influencer content after 12pm (EST). So common, in fact, most of the western users begin posting "whelp, time to go to bed!"

The majority of the content feels regional, though.

  • 0xffff2 3 months ago

    I've never used tiktok... Do you mean 12AM (midnight)? Or are people commonly in the habit of mid-afternoon naps?

  • IncRnd 3 months ago

    12PM is Noon. Did you mean Midnight?

fouronnes3 3 months ago

The question is, was this a conscious human design decision or did the algorithm learn to do that by itself?

  • numpad0 3 months ago

    I would believe if someone said it was completely organic. It's just how Internet is and how social graphs build up. The typical American notion that the Internet is nearly 100% dominated by American English socio-cultural platform and English is the foundational language of the world's all cognitive processing is just an annoying megalomaniac hallucination.

    English is used as a lot as a fallback language for inter-cultural exchanges. In that sense it's kind of dominating, but that's it. Intra-cultural communications happens in local languages, and even if that preferred language happened to be one of en-* locales, that only means everyone is functionally bilingual, and it doesn't mean cultural informational borders don't exist. Data still only goes through bridging connections.

  • jrflowers 3 months ago

    Considering the algorithm did not crawl out of the primordial ooze unbidden by man I am going to guess the former.

    • markeroon 3 months ago

      The recommendation engine is at least partially learned so it’s fairly likely that it’s the latter

  • mrbungie 3 months ago

    The algo learned "by itself", but humans set a objetive to optimize and then implemented it to do so as well as it they could.

    So essentially both I guess?

    • numpad0 3 months ago

      It tends to get people annoyed if you don't. Facebook user distribution is like 12% Indian and 6% American. Twitter is(was) 34% English and 16% Japanese. Bluesky was at one point 43% Japanese. If your feed ISN'T filled with Hindi, Chinese, Spanish, Japanese and so on, with only one in five or less made in English sent from US, your feed is tampered with. But otherwise that social media would be genuinely less useful.

      Mastodon only had the raw feed and that drove European network operators insane, so much so that they effectively GFW'd itself.

  • svnt 3 months ago

    Why is that the question? If it learned to do it by itself it still is being allowed to do it by humans.

  • moralestapia 3 months ago

    You don't deserve the downvotes from the immature peeps around here. Your question is 100% valid.

    I would lean for the latter, the simple explanation may be that people just prefer local content.

ehsankia 3 months ago

Canada and potentially the UK are gonna be having the biggest shock I guess. Potentially Australia too?

[removed] 3 months ago
[deleted]
dayjah 3 months ago

Source?

My anecdotal evidence of watching TikTok usage on others’ phones while riding subway systems in Paris suggest there’s plenty of English-language content out there.

  • permo-w 3 months ago

    in Morocco most of the adults speak French and Arabic, so when they need to speak to an Englisher they get some kids over to help because they all speak English from TikTok

  • prmoustache 3 months ago

    I think it really depends on the size of the population speaking a language.

    For instance my partner sees almost only spanish content, and a huge majority is from latin america.

    We are living in Europe.

runjake 3 months ago

As an American in the US, I get quite a bit of foreign and foreign language content under For You.

This is the inverse to the situation you describe but it makes me doubtful that non-US don't see a lot of American content.

  • graeme 3 months ago

    The algo bends to your interests. But it's trivial to test the default reach if you ever post a video. They show stats for viewer location.

    You can even find guides by people trying to make their phone seem american so they can reach us audiences.

blackeyeblitzar 3 months ago

TikTok is surprisingly national at the surface level, but it is all coordinated back with the parent China based entities (ByteDance, Douyin, and the CCP), so that even if it is national, it upholds China’s national interests. See the story at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42739855 for more details. But basically, TikTok executives had to agree to let ByteDance monitor their personal devices, swear oaths to uphold various goals of the CCP (“national unity” “socialism” etc), report to both a US-based manager and a China-based manager, uphold the CCP’s moderation/censorship scheme, and so on. It is REALLY aggressive and unethical, but also reveals how subtly manipulative the entire system of TikTok is.

  • gunian 3 months ago

    Do you think it would be possible to show this programmatically? As in scrape n posts from TikTok and Reels and show the first displays CCP tendencies?

    Or is this like a general US freedom China dictator logic

    • insane_dreamer 3 months ago

      It actually doesn't matter whether TT has done it already or not.

      What matters is that it has the __capability__ of doing it, in ways that would be difficult to detect, when it proves expedient to do so.

      • markdown 3 months ago

        Yup, but of course more than one person has to agree for this to actually happen. Which is not the case for other apps, like Twitter/X. If Musk wants to remove a government, he has only to promote "free speech" and let falsehoods and misinformation dominate his platform.

  • lupire 3 months ago

    You are conflating strong Chinese Communist control of the business with how the content behaves. TikTok is full of content that would put a Chinese person in prison.

    See this 2019 article outlining Chinese Communist moderation policies that (obviously) were attached to the app when TikTok was new, but were removed for non-Chinese user communities.

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/sep/25/revealed-...

    • imbnwa 3 months ago

      There's a Chinese creator on there Huey Li who just made a whole video about that as part of a story about how, now living stateside, he can no longer write in his mother language

realusername 3 months ago

I don't think it does, I don't see any single content from my country's language. Tiktok is very good at adapting the content to you.

the_clarence 3 months ago

If its like Reels (I dont use tiktok) as soon as you are in France its only French content. Same for youtube.

  • qingcharles 3 months ago

    I actually had to check if TikTok was subject to the French protection laws on localized media quotas. I see it applies to Netflix et al, but not directly to TikTok.

    • the_clarence 3 months ago

      Yeah thats why Netflix has to produce so much french content, they need 60% of their content to be french but there is not enough lol. Thats how we got call my agent

Kiro 3 months ago

Yeah, I never get any views from the US on my videos even though they are in English.