Comment by rob74

Comment by rob74 8 days ago

4 replies

TIL:

Polytonic orthography (from Ancient Greek πολύς (polýs) 'much, many' and τόνος (tónos) 'accent') is the standard system for Ancient Greek and Medieval Greek and includes:

- acute accent (´)

- circumflex accent (ˆ)

- grave accent (`); these 3 accents indicate different kinds of pitch accent

- rough breathing (῾) indicates the presence of the /h/ sound before a letter

- smooth breathing (᾿) indicates the absence of /h/.

Since in Modern Greek the pitch accent has been replaced by a dynamic accent (stress), and /h/ was lost, most polytonic diacritics have no phonetic significance, and merely reveal the underlying Ancient Greek etymology.

(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_diacritics)

dhosek 7 days ago

This seems to be missing the iota subscript (aka ypogegrammeni) which is the source of the weirdness of what happens when casing, e.g., ῳ. (This is another diacritical that modern Greek has abandoned since its impact on pronunciation was already being lost in the classical era (when I took Attic Greek in college, pronunciation wasn’t a critical thing, but we treated all the accents as simply a stress accent, ignored iota subscript and pronounced the rough breathing as h.)

In upper case, ῳ can be written as ῼ, Ω with the subscript or ΩΙ with the distinction between the first two often made as a matter of font design (in fact the appearance of ῼ differs depending on whether it’s in the edit box or in text on this site.

  • dhosek 7 days ago

    One of the features of finl is the ability to have automatic substitutions of character inputs to, e.g., enable the TeX standard for inputing characters like “, ” and —

    Playing with this, I was thinking that I could enable use of the Silvio Levy’s old 7-bit ascii input for Greek and realized that you would need different mappings of characters depending on where the character mapping happened relative to case folding. Text is messier than most peopler realize.

kjellsbells 8 days ago

Reminds me of Vietnamese and its use of diacritics to mark tones. Vietnamese also uses diacritical markings to differentiate some vowels.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnamese_phonology#Tone?wpro...

  • dhosek 7 days ago

    There is speculation that the polytonic accents in Greek (which were a late addition to the alphabet, incidentally), originally were tone markers. ΄ represented a rising tone, ` a falling tone and ῀ a rising then falling tone.