Comment by kstrauser

Comment by kstrauser 9 hours ago

2 replies

> I’d rather have a tool that’s more customizable.

You think you would, until you do, and by then it's too late.

It's important to have good processes, but the point of all those processes is to help you make things more efficiently. Anything that leads to you spending extra time serving the process directly reduces the amount of real work you can do.

structural 7 hours ago

> the point of all those processes is to help you make things more efficiently

I think this viewpoint -- that these processes somehow could increase efficiency if only they were good -- has a lot to do with why engineers dislike systems like Jira, because they will never see the increased efficiency they are looking for.

Let me restate it in a way that I think is a little more nuanced:

The point of systems/processes is to lessen the amount of inefficiency in a group of people working together as that group a) gets larger, and b) experiences turnover.

Nothing's ever going to be as efficient as a single engineer that can build everything with all the details in their head at that very moment. But there's a limitation on size of problems you can solve doing that! So many people working on large problems hate their processes, because each individual person is doing less than if they were in a tiny, stable team, and they can feel this, even if the organization is making great progress.

(And then, at the largest sizes of organization, it's almost impossible to stop the org from crumbling from the weight of its own complexity. People do spend an awful lot of effort trying, though).

  • kstrauser 6 hours ago

    I agree with all of that. I understand why there needs to be some kind of rigor applied or else you have a bunch of engineers running around like cats. I'm not saying we shouldn't have process.

    But, I've also worked in shops so hidebound that the aim of the organization seemed to be to Follow The Process above all else. Didn't ship anything all quarter? Well, at least we Followed The Process! Customers are screaming? That sucks, but The Process doesn't accommodate their needs this quarter. Principal engineers are leaving? They just don't appreciate The Process!

    In my experience, Jira seems to resonate with PMs who adore The Process for the sake of The Process. Lighter, more opinionated systems like Pivotal or Linear seem to help teams deliver features more quickly than teams using Jira to march in line with The Process.