Comment by perlgeek

Comment by perlgeek 21 hours ago

5 replies

Most governments value their law enforcement obligations and/or desire for surveillance more strongly than an Internet that is protected from spying, so good luck with that.

berkes 17 hours ago

Ironically, most of these same sectors in the same governments have strong need to be protected from spying themselves.

So in many cases it's really a case of "we want a monopoly on secrecy".

Which should be a massive red flag for everyone, from left to right, from liberal to conservative, from anarchist to communist and so on. But somehow isn't picked up by any of these. I presume because they all believe somehow they either won't be targeted or will be exempt?

  • pc86 17 hours ago

    Several of those ideologies you mention are just different flavors of authoritarianism, and one of an ideological authoritarian's primary goals is power. Hell, take out "anarchist" and you could make a convincing argument they're all authoritarians in their own way. You don't get power by giving the populace - or helping them to keep - a free, secure Internet. It's just completely antithetical to someone who wants to hold power by nondemocratic means.

    • berkes 12 hours ago

      That was deliberate: a way of saying "probably even those who align with authoritarianism won't like governments to have a monopoly on secrets".

  • perlgeek 15 hours ago

    I don't see government monopolies as immediate red flags.

    In most nations it's widely accept that the state has a monopoly on violence (usually through the police force), and it's not clear to me what a good alternative to that would be.

    I also want my government to have a monopoly on taxation, I don't want any private company or gang to be able to just collect taxes from me, without any repercussion.

    As for secrets? We probably have to distinguish a bit between secrets/data at rest vs. secrets/data in transit. I could well imagine that a good balance between security and privacy could require some tradeoffs when it comes to data in transit.

    • berkes 12 hours ago

      Good point. And while I too accept a state to have a monopoly on things, especially those you mention, secrets aren't those.

      Because we all have them, need them, and because a society cannot function without them - there are many books and papers written about the "nothing to hide fallacy". We all really need some privacy. How much, is a different question, though. So in this discussion: maybe we don't need the level of "TOR by default for everyone", IDK.