Comment by Tiberium 3 days ago
I don't know if you can consider Netcup "small", but their RS 4000 G12 ("root server", basically a VPS with dedicated/guaranteed resources) costs ~€31 for a monthly contract for any location in Europe without VAT included.
It's 12 dedicated cores of a modern EPYC CPU, 32GB RAM, 1TB NVMe.
I got that offer during their Black Friday sale and pay €25/month (price before VAT), plus the offer I got has a 2TB NVMe instead of the 1TB one.
> 20000 / 8 customers / 40 USD/mo = 62 months just to recoup CPU and RAM let alone other components.
the most important question is the power, such a setup will blow through easily 500W of power. Granted, a datacenter may not pay 33 ct/kWh but even then, 1/3rd of the monthly income will just go towards naked electricity, not including cooling.
Electricity costs are ridiculous.
Oversubscribe your hardware and you can do better. Most of your customers are idle most of the time.
Yea some cloud providers are notorious for it.
Netcup does oversubscribe/overshare but not sooo much. I have a server there and I don't really observe too much but although I haven't really gotten ways to detect that stealing factor but there are definitely scripts to detect it, maybe I will run it some day but oh well the laziness.
The most overshared vps provider I know is contabo. Literally search anything on reddit,lowendbox, literally anywhere where there are people and they mention about how ~20-30% figure top of my head could be oversubscribed
I am not exactly sure but my point is that when I first saw them, I found them the cheapest option (with their contabo auctions for something at really scale like 96 gb ram or something) but they are literally out of my book as well even as a frugal guy just because of how unstable they are or how much consistent I have seen people struggle about contabo. It's simply unrecommended imho. Netcup's 10x more pleasant from what I see other people's reaction to. People do mention some stealing factor on netcup but overall its really good and that sort of aligns with my experience with them too ig/
Their goal should be to keep stealing close to zero while utilizing all their hardware. You want this too, because it keeps costs down. It does mean sometimes there will be stealing spikes, but most customers don't want to spend twice as much to avoid that, so it's a win/win.
Agreed. From what I know in hosting business/vps providers, they usually have it for a 2x factor. And honestly its not even noticable so much mostly as you mention not unless they have a crazy factor like from what I hear contabo has from forums
This is also the reason why vps's are said to not use 100% usage 24/7 as it can be noisy for other people.
Also another interesting idea by netcup is that they launche virtual dedicated cores (but still vps at heart) where you actually can use 100% usage 24/7 but to be honest on websites like lowendtalk, I have heard that be described as eerily similar to either bare metal instance or this new cloud metal instance terminology as well but the difference to me feels vdedicores atleast on netcup are focused to be more cheaper than dedicated in many instances but I haven't compared it but I have heard it be described as such in lowendtalk ig.
I got a netcup 500 gb server 8 gigs ram 4v cpu and everything with my frugal nature with getting a 5 euro voucher and I was following/seeing their advent calendar too which offered 1 month free
so for 3 months, I got 1 month free, another month with the 5 euro voucher and essentially only paid for the last month.
I ended up paying 8$ in total for the 3 months. Although after the 3 months, I have to pay more around ~5-6$ per month but its still a recurring deal so I guess I might as well continue it (given I have setten everything up)
Some of it is definitely lose making as well to lock in. I usually try to see what gets me to buy a deal because i usually don't buy many things especially online and its usually within some deal concept where I feel like "winning" that I do.
But to be honest, I did some napkin math and honestly, at least for my VPS (although Its usually idle but I have hosted many services on it or experimented with it, its honestly pretty fun imo, I definitely feel so much more freedom imo somehow after getting a vps its hard to explain I suppose or maybe not idk)
But my napkin maths suggests that they lose quite a lot of money with atleast my deal in particular so I got better off getting this deal than say if I was netcup myself somehow (because they probably lose net money on my deal if I actually really use my allocated limits I guess) atleast for the 3 months but I feel like netcup's still one of the more cheaper options and I got a recurring discount deal with it too sooo I would still consider them to have only marginal profits over a long term deal as well.
SO I guess overall, this was a really profitable deal for me.
Your deal's pretty cool too, honestly at large scale. I have done scraping of lowendtalk and analyzed and done many decisions and infrastructural decisions and honestly I will say taht for anything somewhat large scale like you mention 32 gb or something, I found hetzner boxes to be the best/most referred to option & OVH kimsufi line is created to be the cheapest dedicated boxes.
But yeah regarding OVH i recommend this website that I found regarding OVH KS line or just in general https://checkservers.ovh
Just checked it right now and I see Xeon E-2274G 4c / 8t 4.4 GHz+ 32 GB DDR4 ECC 2666 MHz 2 x 960 GB NVMe for around 37-38 euros ish
Also Netcup's definitely not small. I looked at anexia group and I wouldn't constitute them as small. For understanding what small means I guess when I mean small, I mean lowendbox single shop providers and others.
Also regarding Netcup, its payment system was really ass from what I felt like. Like It was the first company which made me feel like I wanted to pay it money but I had to make a CCP or some account nad literally had to go through like 3-4 really long things imo which really made me say (wtf) in my head each time and frustrated me only to give me a stripe link in the end.
It had me so pissed that for 2-3 days one idea of simplifying its whole process and other such providers stuck in my head. Its payment / the whole process of I want to pay -> create account -> actually pay had like 5-6 maybe 7 steps or something and I seriously can't tell you how I frustrated I was but the deal was too lucrative lol
So with 8 customers per box (AMD EPYC™ 9645 CPU has 96 cores) if they have single-cpu boxes, that would need 256 GiB RAM.
CPU launch price 11000 USD. RAM will likely be another 10000 USD
20000 / 8 customers / 40 USD/mo = 62 months just to recoup CPU and RAM let alone other components.
Weird, whenever I napkin math offers of any HW for renting, I get that I could buy it myself in 1-2 years of rent. Sometimes faster.
Do they not intend to recoup the costs of HW? :)