Comment by nobody9999

Comment by nobody9999 3 days ago

>Do the children of immigrants have fewer rights than other citizens?

Your response doesn't even approach answering it.

Why is that? Are you unwilling to answer such a question? Did you misunderstand?

Your comment was completely unrelated to the question I asked. Especially since my parents are long dead (51 years and 28 years) and I haven't relied on parental support in 35+ years.

As I mentioned, I'm the child of a non-citizen immigrant. Do you claim that I have fewer rights than other citizens? If so, which rights, and what justification do you use to make such a claim?

That's not a rhetorical question.

15155 3 days ago

I am not talking about your rights: this is a strawman argument. Nobody is talking about you, an adult citizen - was the context difficult to follow?

Maybe English isn't your first language: when people are talking about "children" - they don't mean typically "adult child."

The children (see: not adults) of illegal immigrants who are deported don't have "less rights" in this case than a citizen child.

Let's follow the thread:

> US citizens were extradited? Who? To where?

>> Invariably someone will shoot back with "citizen children of illegal immigrants."

>>> Do the children of immigrants have fewer rights than other citizens?

How exactly does your "my rights!!!" diatribe make sense in context here? Why would "adult children" be the implication in this sentence?

In case you weren't aware: there has been much recent controversy about families being deported together despite their children being citizens - this is what I was referring to. As an adult citizen, you would not be subject to deportation as you do not need a guardian. Find something else to be outraged about.

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nobody9999 3 days ago

>I am not talking about your rights: this is a strawman argument.
Whose rights should I be talking/concerned about? Are my rights unimportant? Shall we just go ahead and strip me of my citizenship because I'm not talking about what you want me to talk about?
It's literally the question I asked and your position on that specific question I wanted to understand. I did not misrepresent your belief/argument, rather I asked you to elucidate your thoughts on a specific question.[1]
That's not a strawman argument, that's being curious about your beliefs and understanding of the laws of the United States.
In fact, your initial reply to my comment was, in fact, a straw man as you argued against a claim that I never made -- that somehow asking about the rights of the children, their age is irrelevant, as everyone is someone's child, of immigrants only related to the minor children of undocumented immigrants -- I made no such claim, except in the straw man you set up.
If you didn't want to answer that question, you were under no obligation to reply to me at all. Yet you chose to do so and argue against a claim I never made.
So it was you, not me who engaged in "refuting an argument different from the one actually under discussion, while not recognizing or acknowledging the distinction."[0]
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man
[1] I suppose that my question could (as you apparently did) be considered a non-sequitur. Definitely not a straw man, as I didn't argue for or against anything. Rather,I asked for your beliefs/understanding of US law and the US Constitution.
Edit: Clarified the difference between a straw man and a non-sequitur -- in case GP's first language isn't English.

Reply View | 2 replies
- 15155 3 days ago
  
  People who natively speak English do not assume "children" means "adult children." Obviously everyone is "someone's child."
  Citizen children have rights, illegal immigrants have rights. Nobody's rights are being violated when parents who chose to illegally immigrate are deported.
  Be angry somewhere else. Nobody was talking about your rights or rights at all.
  
  Reply View | 1 reply
  
  nobody9999 3 days ago
  
  >Citizen children have rights, illegal immigrants have rights.
  Finally, progress! Thank you. Just to clarify, does that mean you believe that all citizens, regardless of whether they're born in the US, the children of US citizen(s), as well as those who are naturalized all have the same rights?
  What about non-citizens present (leaving aside diplomats here) in the US? Do you believe that they are under the authority of the US Constitution, US code and the laws of the state/local area where they are?
  If so, do the First, Fourth, Fifth, Sixth and Seventh Amendments, as well as 8USC12[1] apply to those folks?
  >Be angry somewhere else.
  Who's angry? Not me. I wasn't angry before and I'm not angry now. What would give you that idea?
  Or is that just more projection (straw man indeed!) from you?
  >Nobody was talking about your rights or rights at all.
  That's not really true. I was talking about my rights, as well as the rights of others.
  If you don't wish to have this conversation, you're under no obligation to engage with me. I won't be insulted or "angry" either way. I'm sorry that my thought processes seem to get your hackles up. That certainly wasn't my intent.
  Enjoy your day!
  [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_the_United_Sta...
  [1] https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/chapter-12
  
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