Comment by carra

Comment by carra 4 hours ago

15 replies

Thanks, but just like WEBP I'll try to stick to regular JPEGs whenever possible. Not all programs I use accept these formats, and for a common user JPEG + PNG should mostly cover all needs. Maybe add GIF to the list for simple animations, while more complex ones can be videos instead of images.

striking 4 hours ago

"JPEG XL" is a little bit of a misnomer as it's not just "JPEG with more bits". It supports lossless encoding of existing content at a smaller file size than PNG and allows you to transcode existing JPEGs recoverably for a 20% space savings, the lossy encoding doesn't look nearly as ugly and artifacted as JPEG, it supports wide gamut and HDR, and delivers images progressively so you get a decent preview with as little as 15% of the image loaded with no additional client-side effort (from https://jpegxl.info/).

It is at least a very good transcoding target for the web, but it genuinely replaces many other formats in a way where the original source file can more or less be regenerated.

  • AlienRobot 20 minutes ago

    Honestly, I don't like how webp and now jpegxl support both a lossless and lossy mode.

    Let's say you want to store images lossless. This means you won't tolerate loss of data. Which means you don't want to risk it by using a codec that will compress the image lossy if you forget to enable a setting.

    With PNG there is no way to accidentally make it lossy, which feels a lot safer for cases you want lossless compression.

Sammi 4 hours ago

You can really treat WebP as a universally available format in 2026. It is an old, boring, and safe format to use now.

Browser support for WebP is excellent now. The last browser to add it was Safari 14 in September 16, 2020: https://caniuse.com/webp

It got into Windows 10 1809 in October 2018. Into MacOS Big Sur in November 2020.

Wikipedia has a great list of popular software that supports it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WebP#Graphics_software

  • carra an hour ago

    Unfortunately being universal implies way more than just having good browser support. There are quite a few image processing programs without webp or jpeg-xl support. I'm using Windows 11 and the default image viewer can't even open webp... Also, keep in mind that due to subscription models there are many people stuck with older Photoshop versions too.

    • spider-mario an hour ago
      • majora2007 14 minutes ago

        I never knew about this either and it's been very frustrating as I've been converting my Manga library over to webp (savings are insane) and doing any spot checking opens Edge.

        Edit: After reading the comments, this doesn't seem to open in Photos App.

      • carra an hour ago

        Thanks, I know about this and other workarounds. My point is, if it was truly universal you should not need anything! I bet most regular users will never even know this exists.

  • Y-bar 4 hours ago

    Webp can be really annoying once you hit certain encoding edge cases.

    One customer of mine (fashion) has over 700k images in their DAM, and about 0.5% cannot be converted to webp at all using libwebp. They can without problem be converted to jpeg, png, and avif.

    • jdiff 3 hours ago

      Just out of curiosity, what's the problem libwebp has with them? I wasn't aware of cases where any image format would just cross its arms and refuse point blank like that.

      • Y-bar 3 hours ago

        We have never been able to resolve it better than knowing this:

        Certain pixel colour combinations in the source image appear to trip the algorithm to such a degree that the encoder will only produce a black image.

        We know this because we have been able to encode the images by (in pure frustration) manually brute forcing moving a black square across the source image on different locations and then trying to encode again. Suddenly it will work.

        Images are pretty much always exported from Adobe, often smaller than 3000x3000 pixels. Images from the same camera, same size, same photo session, same export batch will work and then suddenly one out of a few hundred may become black, and only the webp one not other formats, the rest of the photos will work for all formats.

        A more mathematically inclined colleague tried to have a look at the implementation once, but was unable to figure it out because they could apparently not find a good written spec on how the encoder is supposed to work.

ashirviskas 4 hours ago

You should never use GIF anymore, it is super inefficient. Just do video, it is 5x to 10x more efficient.

https://web.dev/articles/replace-gifs-with-videos

  • jdiff 3 hours ago

    There's odd cases where it still has uses. When I was a teacher, some of the gamifying tools don't allow video embeds without a subscription, but I wanted to make some "what 3D operation is shown here" questions with various tools in Blender. GIF sizes were pretty comparable to video with largely static, less-than-a-second loops, and likely had slightly higher quality with care used to reduce color palette usage.

    But I fully realize, there are vanishingly few cases with similar constraints.

    • ascorbic 3 hours ago

      For those you can often use animated WebP, or even APNG. They all have close to universal support and are usually much smaller.

      • adzm 2 hours ago

        AVIF works here also. Discord started supporting it for custom emoji.