Comment by bhouston
Comment by bhouston 2 days ago
Returning as a US on shore manufacturer of Apple designed chips, and apparently not the leading edge ones. This feels like making Trump happy while Apple keeps full control.
Comment by bhouston 2 days ago
Returning as a US on shore manufacturer of Apple designed chips, and apparently not the leading edge ones. This feels like making Trump happy while Apple keeps full control.
> don’t see it as a bad thing for Intel
Isn't this a ringing success for their strategy of separating chip design from fabrication?
Maybe, it's unclear at the moment.
Apple is known to be one of the kings of putting their suppliers over a barrel. There's a good chance this is mainly a move to negotiate a better deal with TSMC, and even if it's not, the chance that Intel gets a boat load of profit out of it is very small.
And historically when fabs have been separated from a business, it's always been in a way to shed a capital intensive albatross. In that case, they're normally loaded up with so much debt in the divorce that they were essentially never intended to succeed or continue to keep up, but instead just barely stay afloat on the already capitalized investment.
> the chance that Intel gets a boat load of profit out of it is very small
Why? TSMC seems to be doing ok. It’s worked with RAM and SSD suppliers the same way and they seem to be doing ok too. So does Foxconn. Apple has been known to subsidise leading edge nodes in exchange for priority or temporary exclusivity, and is absolutely ruthless, but it does not prevent its partners from being successful.
> And historically when fabs have been separated from a business, it's always been in a way to shed a capital intensive albatross
That is true. But there are other factors that might be worth considering. First, Apple hates being dependent on a single supplier (which is a single point of failure). Then, hedging risks related to the security situation in Taiwan makes sense. Whether it means subsidising a new TSMC plant in the West or subsidising a new Intel plant might not be that huge a difference. Finally, it might apply some gentle and friendly pressure on TSMC by threatening to shift some production to a competitor.
Whether all this makes sense or not depends on quantitative and qualitative analysis based on data we don’t really have.
Fabrication also depends on what is designed, no? There is a coupling between the two?
Not in most cases. Apple, AMD, and most other chip makers lack a fab. The design what the fabs can make, but they don't have much input into the fabs. Someone makes a fab, and you make something it can made.
Of course things are never that neat. I have no doubt the large players have input into the fabs - we have no idea what. However the two teams are still different companies, when the fab and chip design are the same company there is the possibility of more cooperation (or less - we don't know. In the best case for both there is more when it is all internal, but we don't know if this is the best case)
I'm kinda surprised this deal seems to be 18A still. While progress, 14A is what really matters, as Intel has more or less been threatening to just give up if they don't get a large 14A commitment(unless that's changed recently).
Though, if this goes well, it stands to reason Apple may be that needed commitment.
This might make Trump happy, but more importantly it makes the military happy. No military leader with any intelligence is happy with so much critical for war supply chain being in China or Taiwan - the two are showing signs of going to war with each other in the future. (it may not happen, but there are enough signs military and political leaders should worry). Military leaders are not just the US, leaders in Europe are happy too - they may not trust the US but the US is still at least a second option (and Trump is 79: he is statistically unlikely to live much longer)
Those in the federal government that spy on American citizens are also happy that they are getting to leverage the $11.1 billion of taxpayer dollars they gave to Intel.
Getting foundry services off the ground requires starting somewhere. Apple is hedging. I don’t see it as a bad thing for Intel.