Comment by jeffhuys

Comment by jeffhuys 20 hours ago

It's really simple to me:

- abortion should only be allowed if needed because of health or exceptional cases like rape - abortion should not be used as a form of birth control, use condoms or the morning-after pill

I'm fine with states deciding the details. I think it should be mandated that it's always allowed when health is in danger (I believe this is already true), and it should be mandated that even if a state allows abortion "just by choice" (so, as birth control), it should definitely not be allowed after 9 months even.

> The anti-abortion people do not care about actual outcomes.

I'm anti-abortion, but I really, really do care about outcomes. So if you want to discuss this with me, I'd love to.

> You get people who think life is so sacred abortion should be banned allied with people who'd like to see an AR-15 under every pillow

I don't understand the problem with this... Not wanting to kill unborn life but still wanting to be able to protect yourself and your family when someone breaks into your house.

It's statements like this that make me question the intellectual honesty of people. It doesn't take much thinking to understand it, right?

itishappy 19 hours ago

> I don't understand the problem with this... Not wanting to kill unborn life but still wanting to be able to protect yourself and your family when someone breaks into your house.

The point (as I understood it) isn't that they're incompatible, the point is that they're disparate beliefs and one doesn't necessary imply the other, but our political system treats them as if they do. There simply is no party for people who support abortion and gun control or for people who oppose abortion but like guns, but there are people with those beliefs.

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jeffhuys 19 hours ago

Oh, like that! Yeah, fully agree. This is one of the reasons the conspiracy theory "they both answer to the same group of overlords" is so big. I still wish I lived in America, though.

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unbalancedevh 19 hours ago

> It's statements like this that make me question the intellectual honesty of people. It doesn't take much thinking to understand it, right?

It isn't a matter of intellectual honesty. People who think assault rifles should be banned don't necessarily believe that you shouldn't be able to protect yourself. (It doesn't take much thinking to understand that, right?)

The issues are much more complicated and intertwined than people are willing to deal with, making it easy to fall back on a couple simple ideas like "don't kill unborn life" and "let me have an AR-15 to protect myself." But when you start digging into the ramifications of unwanted children, the social programs required to support them, the impact on the parents, etc.; and what it means to let every tom/dick/harry own and carry whatever weapon they want, even if there's a background check and mandatory training; you get into details for which there is no clear best, or even good, solution. We do have reality to deal with.

People only have so much energy to spend on understanding issues that don't affect them personally, and different people are affected by different issues. So of course there will be wide gaps between perspectives and how those perspectives are expressed. That doesn't mean anyone is being intellectually dishonest.

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pixl97 17 hours ago

Typically with this view

>I don't understand the problem with this... Not wanting to kill unborn life

The people in question have zero scientific understanding of what's entailed here which leads to states like Texas where doctors let pregnant women die rather than risk being charged by the Christian Nationalist state.

These issues are nuanced and complex and require actual understanding rather than short political quips and people yelling "of course it's simple".

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