Comment by ceejayoz
Comment by ceejayoz 3 days ago
This is the old "at least Hitler made the trains run on time" thing again.
I'm all for removing dyes from food, but if the tradeoff is bringing back polio, no thanks.
Comment by ceejayoz 3 days ago
This is the old "at least Hitler made the trains run on time" thing again.
I'm all for removing dyes from food, but if the tradeoff is bringing back polio, no thanks.
It seems the group that is 'all about science' doesn't want to investigate big pharma. It's a strange world.
see: https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2019/05/03/7190377...
I read about this right before covid in Wired magazine. Now, they lick the assholes of all the big pharma companies and anyone wanting more science are 'deniers', turning it into a relgion.
It seems like the Philippine government and WHO are at fault here, rather than Sanofi
No it's not - the topic is healthier food. If someone said "I bet Hitler[0] will reverse this thing that makes trains run on time" and someone said "actually Hitler loves trains running on time", that would be a fair response.
This is the old "the person my news sources repeatedly tell me to dislike is like Hitler".
[0] Mussolini, no?
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42712142
> Removing dyes and healthier food in general is one of RFK's stated goals
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9577438/
> On July 21, 2022, the USA witnessed the first case of poliomyelitis after 3 decades of its eradication.
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/13/health/polio-vaccine-outb...
> Robert F. Kennedy Jr., a longtime vaccine skeptic who may become the secretary of health and human services, has said the idea that vaccination has nearly eradicated polio is “a mythology.”
> The virus that paralyzed the young man had been circulating for months, and it was later detected in the sewage of multiple New York counties with vaccination rates hovering around 60 percent, prompting the state to declare an emergency.
My apologies, I didn't realize RFK was enacting policy in 2022.
RFK has been a prominent voice in the anti-vax world for many years.
Including helping worsen a measles outbreak. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Samoa_measles_outbreak
Not the sort of person you want to promote to policy decisions, where he can do more damage.
> How, exactly, are they causing that to come about?
By spreading rumours and falsehoods about vacines. Which reduce vacination rates and leaves an opening for diseases like polio to spread.
Which part of that are you having trouble believing? Just so we can chat about those parts.
People affiliated with RFK's orbit are advocating for removing approval for the polio vaccine because it wasn't validated with double-blind studies. There's some obvious reasons why that is problematic.
It's really obvious how poorly this stuff plays out, you look at New York. When you read a news story about polio/measles/whopping cough etc, from New York, it will say "it was detected in New York City (or Brooklyn), Orange, Rockland and Sullivan counties".
That's often indiciative of a specific sect of orthodox Jewish communities whose charismatic leader is against vaccination. It's a tight-knit community that tends to live in densely populated environments. (So more viral spread than similar relgious sects like the Amish) People tend to follow the guidance and don't vaccinate. Fortunately, while polio virus has been detected in samples, as far as I know there are not any cases. Measles and whopping cough cases are fairly common.
This isn't a "left" and "right" issue. It's an authoritarian issue where seeding mistrust of institutions is important. Polio hasn't been eradicated to the point that eliminating vaccination is smart. Smallpox was -- and we don't vaccinate the general public anymore. (We do vaccinate soliders as the Soviets/Russians/USA weaponized it)
While the US uses an inactivated polio vaccine, many countries still use a polio vaccine created using an attenuated virus. This virus can revert to a dangerous form. This happens if you have a partially vaccinated population.
This means that unvaccinated people can be infected with a strain of polio that can cause paralysis. This is extremely rare in the US (there was one case of one affected person in 2022).
Currently, the polio vaccine is recommended in the US, and vaccination rates in different US States are between 86% (Idaho) and 99% (Mississippi). If the vaccination rate decreases, it is possible that polio cases will become more common, or even that polio might become endemic again.
RFK has said conflicting things about the polio vaccine. Aaron Siri, a lawyer affiliated with Kennedy, petitioned the FDA to revoke polio vaccine's approval, but RFK said that he supports the polio vaccine in response. I think it's fair to be skeptical, though, given his general position on vaccines.
If RFK's actions cause polio vaccination rates to fall, there is a real reason to be concerned. I don't think this is scaremongering, this is a plausible possibility based on what we know about polio, and about RFK's position on vaccination.
Don't forget measles, which is back after being declared eliminated from the United States in 2000.
https://apnews.com/article/robert-f-kennedy-vaccines-trump-r...
> Kennedy has insisted that he is not anti-vaccine, saying he only wants vaccines to be rigorously tested, but he also has shown opposition to a wide range of immunizations. Kennedy said in a 2023 podcast interview that “There’s no vaccine that is safe and effective” and told Fox News that he still believes in the long-ago debunked idea that vaccines can cause autism. In a 2021 podcast he urged people to “resist” CDC guidelines on when kids should get vaccines.
> “I see somebody on a hiking trail carrying a little baby and I say to him, better not get them vaccinated,” Kennedy said.
> That same year, in a video promoting an anti-vaccine sticker campaign by his nonprofit, Kennedy appeared onscreen next to one sticker that declared “IF YOU’RE NOT AN ANTI-VAXXER YOU AREN’T PAYING ATTENTION.”
"There's no vaccine that is, you know, safe and effective."
RFK on Lex Fridman's podcast.
We do have long-term studies on vaccines. Vaccines are some of the best-studied medical intervention. There is plenty of data about their efficacy and side-effects. Implying that we "need more studies" before we can be sure about vaccines is, in my opinion, dishonest and misleading.
Wasn't that said of Benito Mussolini?